Dev Blog: How Will the Upcoming Steam Integration Work?

[Gardum]

Pity the wipe doesn't happen once it goes to Steam as having to wait another 9+ months before I can play my permanent Main really doesn't give me much enthusiasm to play until near the end of the year as anything I collect or do till then is all wasted time.

Will levels be increased with the Steam release or over the next 9+ months as that would give reason to play, do we get to keep skills that we gain after steam or only what we gained as Alpha testers ?

If we get to keep what skills we gain once Beta starts then you may as well do the wipe from Steam release as we have to pay to play any way ?

Great game by the way, we were looking for an AC replacement for so long and PG is the closest to a game worth playing and putting some years into as we did with AC.

Cheers

[pete4613]

Pity the wipe doesn't happen once it goes to Steam as having to wait another 9+ months before I can play my permanent Main really doesn't give me much enthusiasm to play until near the end of the year as anything I collect or do till then is all wasted time.

Will levels be increased with the Steam release or over the next 9+ months as that would give reason to play, do we get to keep skills that we gain after steam or only what we gained as Alpha testers ?

If we get to keep what skills we gain once Beta starts then you may as well do the wipe from Steam release as we have to pay to play any way ?

Great game by the way, we were looking for an AC replacement for so long and PG is the closest to a game worth playing and putting some years into as we did with AC.

Cheers

Pardon me, but theres no reason to say that what players are doing right now is a waste of time when its not. Skills wont be wiped. What I've heard that im certain of is everything associated with the economy, money, items, favor etc.

Also, long ago it was said that up to the release on steam, the game would be at or near the 100-120 levels, however I'm not sure were nearing that within the next two weeks.

[Hipparchia]

Ty for the update

[Gardum]

Pardon me, but theres no reason to say that what players are doing right now is a waste of time when its not. Skills wont be wiped. What I've heard that im certain of is everything associated with the economy, money, items, favor etc.

Also, long ago it was said that up to the release on steam, the game would be at or near the 100-120 levels, however I'm not sure were nearing that within the next two weeks.

I couldn't find any information about the levels you mentioned, nor was it in the blog post about going to steam.

That was why my questions came into being I wanted clarification on what happens with Steam release as we need to own the game to continue playing it's no longer a free game ok ?

We were told Alpha testers would get to keep their skills, does this now include Beta testers if they have bought the game to play ?

If as I said we need to pay for the game to continue playing and we get to keep all skills learnt during the beta phase why not do the wipe now ?

Do we lose anything worse than waiting another 9+ months ? Would you be worse off in some way if you get to keep your skills any way ?

I don't understand your response to my quite reasonable question as though by them doing the wipe now you would be worse off ?

If they did the wipe at Steam launch we have something worth playing for as far as Guild quests go and as far as crafting.

Now all effort put into levelling a Guild will be totally wasted time and effort as nothing from that will be kept as Guilds aren't a Skill.

Why not wipe now you paid to continue playing and then we get to keep what we paid for at retail.

People can't complain about us getting to keep our skills if they could have started playing at Steam release Early access or not as they had the chance to pay to play then as well.

Same as if you decided to play any of the previous MMo's now you would enter a mature world.

People that want to be the explorers are people like myself and probably you as well since you are in the Alpha stage and we are the types of people that play the games with all the bugs and such as we enjoy helping a game become great (Hopefully) by finding bugs and giving suggestions and such.

I am sure you have paid for the game as otherwise you can't continue to play any way so a waste of your reply

Also I am 100% correct in anything I do with my toon from Beta on is a waste of time unless more levels are added as I can't level it any further and any skills I gain in other abilities will be only a thing I do as a past time since I can't level my character any further and I enjoy the two classes I use now.

Please explain your worries or doubts about why a wipe at Steam release would be a bad thing ?

[Citan]

@Gardum - no, we aren't wiping guilds. We're wiping items to make the launch economy work better. Deleting guilds doesn't impact the economy so it'd just be dickish for no benefit.

Yes, of course skills earned during beta will be kept. Again, we're wiping items, not skills.

And yep, there will be more levels added during beta, that's what I meant by extending the game.

We aren't wiping items NOW, because that the game isn't balanced yet and many of the economic features aren't implemented.

Item wipe isn't a punishment. "Why not punish us now and get it over with?" is really the heart of your question, and the answer is: it's not being done as a punishment. It's an attempt to make the game economy work better after the game mechanics are fleshed out and balanced. It's not finished yet, so if we wiped things now we'd just have to wipe again at launch.

I know you have lots of questions, probably more that haven't been asked yet, and I'm happy to answer them. But please start from the idea that we're trying to be kind. I'm extremely grateful for the people who've taken the time to play this very-unfinished game over the years and I want to do right by them. That's why I don't want to wipe prematurely or over-aggressively. I'm going to be as surgical as possible about WHEN and WHAT we wipe because wiping stuff sucks: most people feel like it's wasting their time, making them repeat things they've already done and don't want to do again. But we can't avoid wipes entirely, so we'll make it as minimal as we can.

[Citan]

Can't recall which email address i've been using, does it matter if i buy a package using any email address?

We'll email you your keys via the email address you bought the package with (your kickstarter email, or your paypal email, etc.), not with the email address assigned to your game account right now. In other words, you don't need to use the same email as you used when you registered your game account.

When would this part of the VIP package actually be available? Specifically, will it be available slightly before Steam is absolutely required, so we could transfer items from a not-paid-for mule account to a different account that is maxed out on character slots right now?

Unfortunately the VIP system won't be ready until well after the Steam launch is finished. Sorry about that -- it's just due to how we need to order the feature implementation.

[Tchey]

I'm an happy Linux gamer.

[Gardum]

@Gardum - no, we aren't wiping guilds. We're wiping items to make the launch economy work better. Deleting guilds doesn't impact the economy so it'd just be dickish for no benefit.

Yes, of course skills earned during beta will be kept. Again, we're wiping items, not skills.

And yep, there will be more levels added during beta, that's what I meant by extending the game.

We aren't wiping items NOW, because that the game isn't balanced yet and many of the economic features aren't implemented.

Item wipe isn't a punishment. "Why not punish us now and get it over with?" is really the heart of your question, and the answer is: it's not being done as a punishment. It's an attempt to make the game economy work better after the game mechanics are fleshed out and balanced. It's not finished yet, so if we wiped things now we'd just have to wipe again at launch.

I know you have lots of questions, probably more that haven't been asked yet, and I'm happy to answer them. But please start from the idea that we're trying to be kind. I'm extremely grateful for the people who've taken the time to play this very-unfinished game over the years and I want to do right by them. That's why I don't want to wipe prematurely or over-aggressively. I'm going to be as surgical as possible about WHEN and WHAT we wipe because wiping stuff sucks: most people feel like it's wasting their time, making them repeat things they've already done and don't want to do again. But we can't avoid wipes entirely, so we'll make it as minimal as we can.

Cheers for the reply and I wasn't really meaning it as though a wipe is a punishment as I have played other Alphas and always look forward to the wipe so that I can start for good
I don't see playing Alpha and beta as a waste of time as it helps make the game better in the long run, usually

So Guilds stay none of my Guild new that as we talked about how long it would take us to get the councils and what ever other items would be needed to make the guild at Launch as well as how to keep in touch with all the members that weren't registered on our guild website.

You have more than answered any queries we had and once I let my guild know these facts there will be a lot of happier people

Cheers and keep up the great work.

[Silvonis]

@Gardum - no, we aren't wiping guilds. We're wiping items to make the launch economy work better. Deleting guilds doesn't impact the economy so it'd just be dickish for no benefit.

Yes, of course skills earned during beta will be kept. Again, we're wiping items, not skills.

And yep, there will be more levels added during beta, that's what I meant by extending the game.

We aren't wiping items NOW, because that the game isn't balanced yet and many of the economic features aren't implemented.

Item wipe isn't a punishment. "Why not punish us now and get it over with?" is really the heart of your question, and the answer is: it's not being done as a punishment. It's an attempt to make the game economy work better after the game mechanics are fleshed out and balanced. It's not finished yet, so if we wiped things now we'd just have to wipe again at launch.

I know you have lots of questions, probably more that haven't been asked yet, and I'm happy to answer them. But please start from the idea that we're trying to be kind. I'm extremely grateful for the people who've taken the time to play this very-unfinished game over the years and I want to do right by them. That's why I don't want to wipe prematurely or over-aggressively. I'm going to be as surgical as possible about WHEN and WHAT we wipe because wiping stuff sucks: most people feel like it's wasting their time, making them repeat things they've already done and don't want to do again. But we can't avoid wipes entirely, so we'll make it as minimal as we can.

I want to follow-up on Citan's statement on the wipe, particulary the statement that 'we're wiping items, not skills' because 'only a Sith deals in absolutes'. I just want to reiterate that while we do not plan on wiping skills, it could happen if we determine that it is necessary due to an overarching need (example: major skill redesign that requires it). To that end, here is the 'offical' statement on wipes: "There will not be a complete wipe at launch. That said, we will be wiping some aspects of your character including but not limited to: items, currency, NPC favor levels, and favor-quests. However, we don’t plan on wiping most skill levels. Please note, this is subject to change as we progress through development."

Also: once we are on Steam we will be moving to 'beta', and that means we are in-development and not a released game. You may see some titles using 'beta' as a trial and not an actual beta - but we are truly in-development and those participating should view it as testing and not playing early. We truly need testers, more so than just 'players'. If you are confused on the difference, I would encourage you to check out the PROJECT: GORGON TESTING GUIDE!

[Panties]

I want to follow-up on Citan's statement on the wipe, particulary the statement that 'we're wiping items, not skills'...because we don’t plan on wiping most skill levels. Please note, this is subject to change as we progress through development."

This is very vague and what is written here worries me.

Statistically (and in this case), "most" only means more than 50%, that is, if 49% of skills are wiped at launch, then technically, "most" skills were not wiped.

That when juxtaposed with the last sentence, which essentially says, "We actually can't guarantee you anything", makes this follow-up come across as overtly ominous.

All throughout alpha, we've been putting our trust into Citan and the PG team to make good on the promise of not wiping our skills. As alpha players, we made a deal with you guys to test the game and report bugs in exchange for keeping our hard-earned skills.

As they say, if something is free, then you are the commodity. Under this arrangement then, "testing for skills", I am okay with being the commodity. However if things suddenly changed to, "testing for free", well then I would simply feel just plain taken advantage of.

No doubt, my PG experience has been great fun, but it's also been a lot of hard work. If I knew skills were going to be wiped at launch, I certainly never would have kept playing past just maxing my first combat skills, let alone running around Eltibule farming stomachs for 3 straight weeks just to max a single skill, cheesemaking.

That said, aside from this issue, the PG team has been wonderful to work with. I was truly amazed when Srand replied to one of my bug reports on Christmas Eve. This impressed me so much actually, that I went to the forums and purchased a crowdfunding package as a result.

I truly hope that I am just reading into your follow-up to Citan's post more than was intended. I would love to continue playing PG for years to come, but if a significant portion of my skill levels are reset at launch, I will likely quit forever.