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gillzj00
04-19-2017, 02:33 PM
This is just kind of a question to you guys but I feel, for my level, I am pretty weak and pathetic lol. I am lvl 51 in Archery and I think 49 now in Mentalism. Isn't the max level you can have on any single skill 70 (feel obliged to correct me)? I feel like for being only 19ish levels away from maxing out I am pretty pathetic when it comes to soloing anything. I am still hanging out in the Eltibule Goblin Crypt thing and get pwned there if I take on more than a few mobs. My armor looks like I just got off newb island but I never loot anything better than what I have. I am constantly depleting my power when fighting. I also seem to run slow.

I feel very vulnerable in Kur in general and if I go into the Kur Tower area I can kill 1 or 2 mobs at a time but generally draw 6 of them and get murdered. Is my thinking wrong? Do I feel weak because I am not hunting in groups? I just feel like for lvl 51 I haven't seen much of the map and in general haven't done anything that exciting.

As a note I have focused on my fletching too and I can make Expert level arrows. I am currently using Amazing level arrows I bought from a player vendor.

I guess I could see me feeling like a weak newb if the level cap is 250 or something but would think that at my level I should start feeling like a higher level character and definitely do not.

Thanks for any input ;)!

alleryn
04-19-2017, 02:50 PM
In PG, a large majority of the character's power comes from gear, rather than from levels. This is likely why you feel underpowered. Finding appropriate level gear with the right mods for your build can make a huuge difference.

Another part of it might be Mentalism. I haven't used it much myself, but i believe it's a more group-focused skill, so might be a little on the weak side for soloing. It certainly has some good solo skills, so i could be wrong -- like i said i haven't really tried it myself.

I'd love to give you some advice about where to get better armor, but i'm not really sure. I'm nearing level 70 and still in mostly level 40 gear i found in Sun Vale from Winter Court Fairies. It's hardcore-only armor though, so i'm guessing that's not a lot of help.

Good luck!

pilotfisherman
04-19-2017, 03:14 PM
http://www.gorgonexplorer.com/build-planner

Use this tool to really wrap your head around the mod options then roll the die until you have precisely what you intend to.

Niph
04-19-2017, 03:22 PM
Isn't the max level you can have on any single skill 70?
You can get to 80+ on Mentalism and Psychology, although there are no abilitiies available at the max level you can have.


My armor looks like I just got off newb island but I never loot anything better than what I have.
Yes, for better loot you need to fight in higher level areas, one mob at a time.


I am constantly depleting my power when fighting.
You might want to take a break from fighting and learn some cooking, flower arrangement (or buy food and bouquets from other players, although I'm not sure how the economy is on this since I make my own stuff). On a side note, it is surprising to run out of power for someone using Mentalism.


I also seem to run slow.
Doesn't really matter when you fight, but to run from one place to another maybe you want to learn some basic Battle Chemistry, to get haste buffs.


I feel very vulnerable in Kur in general and if I go into the Kur Tower area I can kill 1 or 2 mobs at a time but generally draw 6 of them and get murdered.
Learning how to extract one mob at a time from a bunch of them is a very useful "skill". Press the ALT key when you target a mob, this will tell you the distance from it, and learn for every mob you fight what the limit is before it notices you. Reaching this limit on the closest mob, then falling back, will pull it single.


I just feel like for lvl 51 I haven't seen much of the map and in general haven't done anything that exciting.
You need a group!


Do I feel weak because I am not hunting in groups?
Groups are indeed more efficient. There is no secret, you need to try repeatedly to make your own.

Good luck. :)

Tagamogi
04-19-2017, 03:47 PM
Sorry in advance if some of my suggestions seem a bit basic. alleryn is correct and a lot of power comes from gear but just to cover everything I can think of:

I'm not sure why you would be running out of power. Are you using your combat refresh abilities (basic shot, mind reave) whenever they'd return power to you? Are you eating? Have you tried stacking the highest level meal your gourmand skill can handle and adding a snack? Mentalism's power wave is also obviously helpful, but I don't think you'd really need it much in the goblin dungeon.

For mentalism, a few of the nicer abilities are unlocked by gaining favor with an NPC in the Serbule mushroom cave, if you haven't found those yet.

For archery, it only matters which ability level you use, not which arrows. If you use a level 1 archery ability, you will do the same damage whether you use a basic arrow or an amazing arrow. Higher level archery abilities require different arrows to use, so that's where you do want different arrow types. However, it looks like at archery 51, the most you should need are expert arrows. You may want to check your abilities to make sure you are always using the highest level available to you - that sounds a bit obvious but I've played around with different loadouts before and accidentallly reset myself to a lower level at times. You may also want to check the Wiki to make sure you aren't missing any really neat abilities taught by an obscure NPC somewhere.

You are not going to get any gear beyond maybe level 35-40 out of the goblin dungeon. To get nicer stuff, you'll need to either take up crafting or kill higher level mobs. Groups can help you with getting better loot pretty easily. I can't really think of any good solo places - you may want to try outside in Kur (you can always hang out near a fire) or possibly Sun Vale. Neither of those will get you level 50+ gear, but maybe at least a couple upgrades from your current stuff to allow you to move on to other areas. I think Kur Tower would be a pretty rough place to solo with archery/mentalism due to all those zombie clusters. You may do better in either the yeti cave or the wolf cave in Kur - the mobs feel less clustered there although they might be a bit higher level than you really want right now. The wolves are vulnerable to poison though, so that might have potential for you... Sorry, I'm really not sure about the best places to go if you want to solo - hopefully someone else will have better suggestions. I primarily leveled with battle chemistry, so what I find easy to solo doesn't really apply to archery.

I don't think there's much you can do about your runspeed - there are a few armor pieces that give a sprint bonus but if you use them, you'll miss out on combat skill bonuses. I don't think either archery or mentalism have any abilities that would help you run faster, unfortunately.

Celler
04-19-2017, 03:52 PM
Ment goes up to around 79 or so I think, mainly drawing bonuses from phren.
I wouldn't consider ment or archery weak, both have been weakened though the Aoe lost from Electrify especially was a style changer.To be honest in Kur you have 2 issues, firstly cold if you don't deal with it properly and have plenty of buffer from warm clothes, good food etc any land based battles are going to get to you soon enough.
Those Zombie like things in kur tower can mob folks quite easily there damage soon mounts up,try walking towards them until 1 or 2 start coming, then back up until there is plenty of room between them and the rest, If you drop an arrow of ment spell in the group they will all come at you.

As for speed with that build your only help is the mod for boots for the ment heal I think. For land based travel I'd switch in a psych or shield skill or both.Or perhaps battle chem. Or get druid for some wings and use the ment skill to keep you airborne for long periods.

Your arrows do need upgrading yes, but it's always been an archery bottleneck for the new folks as it requires carpentry,alchemy and fletching of course.
If your always low on power you need to use better food and flowers to help overall and make sure you use the combat refresh skills to help,It's often better to kill something with 3 or 4 weaker hits than 2 big power hungry bashes.

In lots of ways its not having 2 or 3 combat skills at good lvls that makes you a stronger player.Its being able to cook and eat good food,grow and appreciate good flowers and craft good cold resistant gear etc. Being able to use higher lvls of first aid,armor patch and dig deep etc.
Also as Stated above gear is vital really as is having obtained the higher lvl of skills from mushroom and npc in vale for ment etc.

To be honest the 4 toughest dungeons in game are practically deathtraps alone most wont get far, perhaps there are a few min maxers but I've not seen um, although you can poke around in top of dc .
To be honest at lvl 50 you could perhaps do most of crypt,mushroom,little goblin house,upto fog in goblin,under the hand (not sure about slimes current regen), animal nexus. The rest I'd imagine is beyond you, to be honest even with my skills high there are few other places than that that are not capable of kicking me around especially if I get sloppy.
I do worry that as more players appear the lvl of monster density on surface world may end up being problematic for the lone explorers too at times but we shall see.

Hope you find a way to have some fun

Sasho
04-19-2017, 04:23 PM
I play Sword/Archery and both are maxed. My archery skills are Mangling Shot (2200 dmg), Aimed Shot (800 dmg), Heavy Shot (2400), Multi-Shot (900 dmg), Snare Arrow (500 dmg), and Heavy Mulit-Shot (2100 dmg). Because Mentalism doesn't use a hand slot, allowing you to hold something extra like a cross bow with specific bonuses to archery, I've seen players do over 5k dmg with one arrow of Heavy Shot when they have your kind of load-out.

Here's the thing: you're not going to get good damage with every ability. You'll have to chose your build out but you just wont have room for Long Shot, Basic Arrow, and Blitz Shot all in your combat tab and expect to do a lot of damage. My load is an example of what yours should be - diverse! Stuns, AoE, Simple Shot, Mesmorizes, maybe even a Damage of Time (DoT) of fire if you want. You're going to need to make choices. Second of all, you need to buy those good skills. Mangling Shot is a must because of it's ability to stun and high damage. Initially it's not high, but because almost every piece of armor/jewelry comes with a potential for +dmg% mod on it for Mangling shot it can become strong quickly. I personally don't have anywhere near a perfect set of armor and I'm already doing good damage with it. Your going to need favor and councils to get these skills though. Talk to Elahil in Serbule for that. Third of all, be patient while you hunt the armor and get the mods. I tend to priorities mods that give +damage% to my Mulit-Shot skills first, because I find AoE more valuable (my personal preference). As you find a mod here and there are replace your current armor with it you'll find that really quickly you've become extremely powerful. -If you need help getting armor ask to form a group and kill some bosses in Kur Tower.

As for power, make sure you are using a Meal Food and a Snack Food. Snack Foods give a good +Health +Power bonus, Meals don't usually give any bonus unless it's a drink in which case it's a +Power Bonus. But if you do make cheese (which isn't the priority at the moment), that's the only Meal Food that gives a +Health bonus (yes it also makes Snack Foods as well for some of the highest bonuses in the game). Another way to get power is to gain Nature Appreciation by eating flowers. Flowers can boost your power around +100 for 1 Hour at the highest levels. When you start off eating small ones like Blue Bells they give you +10 Power for like 30 minutes if I remember correctly.

As for run speed, there's really no easy way to do it aside from having a specific load-out. I have a load out of Shield/Battle Chemistry that I use for speed abilities, along with different equipment in my inventory that gives +speed mods. Because the armor sucks in itself, I only use the armor for this load out. But it helps when running from place to place.

Good luck and feel free to ask more questions in game.

Tagamogi
04-19-2017, 04:47 PM
Also, archery is going to get combat bonuses from anatomy and mentalism from phrenology. You are hopefully already working on anatomy but it takes quite a while to level. You can get phrenology from Kur Tower, so if you can't reach the trainer there by yourself, it may be worth asking for help just to learn phrenology and start working on that.

I was also just thinking that a lot of the gear that drops in Kur Tower has archery bonuses built-in, so it's definitely a very nice place to get loot for you if you can find a group, or maybe just a duo partner.

Dragone
04-20-2017, 04:03 AM
I'm hammer/druid so this might not be comparable but when I got into my 60s 70s the abilities upgrade available to buy drastically increased base damage across the board

Crissa
04-20-2017, 12:22 PM
Mobs in the Goblin crypt are up to 45 and can totally group up hard core, so I don't see why a lone 50 ought to be able to solo it? I can solo the entrance, and have for quite some time, but I'll still get owned in the Serbule crypt if I try to solo too far. Especially if I miss and get stunlocked.

As a side note, on a Mac, I have a problem getting ctrl-targeting to work; there's some bug in the UI.

Eachna
04-25-2017, 09:09 AM
There are a lot of "little" bonuses you can get in game from leveling different skills.

Alchemy gives a small boost to Power every few levels. Psychology gives extra bonus levels of Mentalism. There are a lot of skills it's good to get 20-30 levels in just for the passive bonuses and unlocks.

Make sure you always have food buffs, and a snack buff if you can. Buy and use consumables like armor kits and first aid kits. "Good" kits that you buy from Marna are perfectly fine at higher levels, as long as you play conservatively. This will help you keep costs down.

Someone else mentioned it too but use your Basic Attacks. Combat refreshes are really important now. The basic attacks have a blue outline when they give a refresh. I make sure to click one whenever it's blue. It gives back health/armor/power.

Have you found and befriended your special skill trainers? Archery has at least 3 in Serbule and there's others in later zones. I know Mentalism has at least one in Serbule that has the good damage-dealing attacks for Mentalism (electricity-based attacks as a hint).


My armor looks like I just got off newb island but I never loot anything better than what I have. I am constantly depleting my power when fighting. I also seem to run slow.

Pick up armor crafting. That will make a *huge* difference. Cloth armor takes a lot longer to level than leather armor so if you're in hurry (as in wanting to catch up) learn to make leather armor.

Not sure if this is a bug or feature, but the cold weather leather armor recipes are "easier" to get (you need less money up front) and you can wear the armor anywhere (even the desert). So it's perfectly reasonable to learn to leatherwork and then head to Kur and buy the cold weather recipes there.

As you're leveling you can skip the various "max enchanted" recipes to save money.

+1 speed bonuses are good. I didn't realize that when I started. Two items with a +1 bonus let you run visibily faster. Also Battle Chemistry. It's great.


I feel very vulnerable in Kur in general and if I go into the Kur Tower area I can kill 1 or 2 mobs at a time but generally draw 6 of them and get murdered. Is my thinking wrong? Do I feel weak because I am not hunting in groups? I just feel like for lvl 51 I haven't seen much of the map and in general haven't done anything that exciting.

Groups help but I solo a lot because it's hard for me to find people and I can get through a lot of content by being patient and picking mobs off one at a time.

Instead of attacking mobs while they're near their buddies at range, walk forward slowly until *one* mob spots you and starts running toward you. Then back up to a safe area and kill that mob. Learn to the judge the distance where mobs shout for help (and pull other mobs) and pull them further than that. The shout shows as a bang (!) above their head.

Also, consider picking up a skill with a pet (necromancy, animal handling, or battle chemistry). Pets help a bit. Animal Handling and Battle Chem are both cash sinks. Necromancy is pretty cheap until you hit 50.


As a note I have focused on my fletching too and I can make Expert level arrows. I am currently using Amazing level arrows I bought from a player vendor.

Do you also have good mentalism gear with bonuses for your attacks? For random generated gear, make sure at least half your mods apply to the skills you're using. If not, switch some of your skills around until you get better gear.

Marique
05-02-2017, 03:48 AM
I slowly start to dislike more and more how everything depends on gear.
I really like the game but after more then a year into it with the only real motivator being gear and only gear and then some more gear the game start to feel kinda boring to me.
So i leveled up and I'm now 55 instead of 45 and unlocked new skills... absolutely useless and meaningless if you don't have the appropriate level 55 gear. There's no sense of in accomplishment in leveling.

Niph
05-02-2017, 05:05 AM
So i leveled up and I'm now 55 instead of 45 and unlocked new skills... absolutely useless and meaningless if you don't have the appropriate level 55 gear. There's no sense of in accomplishment in leveling.

These new abilities make you more powerful... Maybe there is no sense of accomplishment for you (and perhaps having all abilities learnt automatically as you hit a new level, instead of a few ones, would help with that), but it has an effect similar to looting new gear.

Marique
05-02-2017, 11:07 PM
These new abilities make you more powerful... Maybe there is no sense of accomplishment for you (and perhaps having all abilities learnt automatically as you hit a new level, instead of a few ones, would help with that), but it has an effect similar to looting new gear.

I can get a couple more points of damage when i buy the new ability when i level... Or I can totally ignore that new ability and focus all my time and resources on updated gear and get a quadruple amount of damage points.

I get that new and better gear improves your character, it pretty much works for every (MMO)RPG in that way. Personally I feel that the balance between gear and level is way too much in favor of gear in Gorgon. Gear is everything and the rest comes as an afterthought.
Then I have not even started about player skill yet...

Yertle
05-03-2017, 10:34 AM
Then I have not even started about player skill yet...

Is there much or anything PG has to do with Player Skill? Player Knowledge can be important, but I'm not so sure I would say a significant amount of Skill is very important from what I've seen.

Marique
05-04-2017, 03:43 AM
Is there much or anything PG has to do with Player Skill? Player Knowledge can be important, but I'm not so sure I would say a significant amount of Skill is very important from what I've seen.

No there is none at all, that's my "issue".
A player with full understanding of the game mechanics, abilities and made well thought out action bars with abilities that accomplish each other but fell behind in gear will not even be remotely effective as a player with the highest possible gear who is just completely randomly mashing buttons with absolutely no idea what he/she is doing.

As i said earlier I understand very well that gear plays a part but the balance seems to be off in Gorgon. Player skill/knowledge/level should at least make something up for the lack of the best/highest gear. Right now it does not, gear is absolutely EVERYTHING and the only "true measurement" of what content you can do in game.

Niph
05-04-2017, 08:07 AM
I realize we're talking about opinions here, and I can only totally disagree with you, not bring hard facts with that (or I would).

But seriously, "will not even be remotely effective as a player with the highest possible gear who is just completely randomly mashing buttons" ??

I'll just mention Borghild. Anyone that has explored the place fully certainly realize it's a lot easier once you know the pathing, position, and powers of the various monster there. I challenge anyone with max level and full legendary gear, pick the skills you want, to win against the Forgotten Loading Golem, *just* randomly mashing buttons. Yet a friend and I won it in a duo at level 40, and of course we didn't have the top gear for that level (who would?)

I don't know your character, and what you have experienced of the game, but haven't you at least met Lamias?

P:G has a lot of content where good skills at playing the game is a huge advantage. A lot of content you can currently see *only* if you have these skills, you or someone in your party.

Dragone
05-04-2017, 09:30 AM
I slowly start to dislike more and more how everything depends on gear.
I really like the game but after more then a year into it with the only real motivator being gear and only gear and then some more gear the game start to feel kinda boring to me.
So i leveled up and I'm now 55 instead of 45 and unlocked new skills... absolutely useless and meaningless if you don't have the appropriate level 55 gear. There's no sense of in accomplishment in leveling.

I personally don't think gear so much a game changer, hating the inventory limit as soon as I had enough money I bought shirt and leggings with +20 inventory slots, still managed fine from lv 50ish to 70, could I be more powerful with attributes boosts on shirt and pants? for sure but not so necessary. Lv 45 vs 55 attributes you should see an improvement I sure saw it!

Khaylara
05-04-2017, 10:02 AM
No there is none at all, that's my "issue".
A player with full understanding of the game mechanics, abilities and made well thought out action bars with abilities that accomplish each other but fell behind in gear will not even be remotely effective as a player with the highest possible gear who is just completely randomly mashing buttons with absolutely no idea what he/she is doing.

I completely disagree with you, speaking from experience only. Niph's example is relevant, if you have no clue about what skills to use etc you can have the highest gear possible and still get nowhere. I call that a "high level noob", great gear, maxed skills but completely clueless.

I also disagree that the gear makes it impossible to be any good unless you have the level appropriate gear. As a fire mage I leveled to 50 on my first character in goblin dungeon gear (level 30), I ran wolf cave and Dark Chapel w/o any issues in my lvl 30 gear. For years the cap level was 50 and the gear we had available was level 40-43. It's not only about the level, you can be decked in level 70 gold gear if you don't know how to make a build and strike the balance between damage and defense/heal AND also adapt their build to a specific dungeon or group of mobs.

I will give 2 examples that I encountered very often
-one is necromancers who start raging about "necro is shit" because they can't deal in crypt or Kur tower and not bothering to read that undead mobs resist darkness damage (most necro skills are that damage type)
-the other is fire effect-rage inducing, many archers or even fire mages who reach max level and decide those skills are shit cause they die too often. Why they die? Cause any creature you burn will have their rage meter filled faster and that triggers their rage attacks more often ecco you die more often... What a knowledgeable player would do is offset the rage inducing fire with rage reducing abilities. But many don't bother to read the skill description, treat PG like a hack and slash w/o bothering to read about their skills a bit.

Gear is important ofc but more important than level is choosing the right mods not just stacking dps abilities and mods and having no sustain.
Knowledge equals skill in this game and it takes a bit of reading, asking around and testing to find the right build for you. A nice build does not have to involve max tier gear that you have no clue how to use. I'm fine with level 55-60 gear in GK which is level 70+.

PS Just as another fact anyone can level leatherworking and craft a level 60 or 70 gear, it just takes a bit of effort put into leveling the skill.

Yertle
05-04-2017, 12:50 PM
I will give 2 examples that I encountered very often
-one is necromancers...
-the other is fire effect-rage inducing...

Both of those examples are showing that Knowledge is the requirement, not Skill. Without much of a physics based game and a seemingly relatively low amount options for truly pulling and fighting, then I'm not sure how much Player Skill will grow. Gaining Knowledge is work and a type of skill, but it would be cool to see general Skill grow.

Tsugumori
05-04-2017, 01:41 PM
"Gaining knowledge" doesn't require work. It comes over time.

You can't start in PG and power level your 'knowledge'. There is a large number of players who lack it mainly because, as Khay said, they do not read things. They don't read, they skim. (If even that..)

PG isn't a game that requires skill, I think it would be more 'skills'. One of these skills being reading, another would be thinking ahead/planning.

The real kicker for me is that people seem to have overlooked this sentence by our man Marique:

"I really like the game but after more then a year into it with the only real motivator being gear and only gear and then some more gear the game start to feel kinda boring to me."

I was using 40-50 gear levelling skills to 70, it wasn't the best no, but it got the job done. You're a year into PG, you're at level 50, and you're talking gear? I feel like this is on par with a kid jumping off a bed with an empty pillow case then telling me about their amazing sky-diving adventure. Long way to go, buddy.

Khaylara
05-04-2017, 01:56 PM
Knowledge involves knowing the abilities that complement each other, the skillsets that go well together and what mods to use to maximize your dps and survival. Many abilities are meant to be used in combos/chains, many mods for certain abilities boost other abilities etc. I stand by my opinion, a player with a level 70/70 char in yellow 70 gear can be a complete nub if they don't know anything about their skills (i.e. they could be powerleveled etc)

edit @Tsugu I was surprised too that after a year he is still level 50 and without a craft that would allow him to create said gear. Maybe he took long breaks or is the kind of player who focuses on combat only, don't know. I just think his opinion is mildly exaggerated, gear is not everything.

Khaylara
05-04-2017, 02:23 PM
Separate post cause I thought I should be helpful with gear sourcing for lvl 55

-toolcrafting-snail gear, some animal gear and belts (cause yes, skill base % damage increase is different between level 5 and 50, 8% of a skill that does 800 damage already is great so skill level definitely counts)
-leatherworking-quality or great leather gear+winter gear
-tailoring
-doing manticores in groups, killing other desert mobs for often very good gear drops (purple and above)
-running Lab for gear
-killing Pask
-carpentry for staves and clubs
-transmuting to tailor your gear to suit your build/needs (relatively easy skill to achieve and level)

I prefer crafting myself and my suggestion is picking a craft (someone recommended leatherworking as being easier and I agree with that), focusing on it and never have problems with finding gear again. With a full set of leather gear suited to your level you can run Lab and get better jewellery and weapons. Remember, dungeons require grouping and you should be useful to a group by having some support skills and ress ability. Focus on these things and you won't get bored:)

Eachna
05-04-2017, 08:49 PM
As i said earlier I understand very well that gear plays a part but the balance seems to be off in Gorgon. Player skill/knowledge/level should at least make absolutely EVERYTHING and the only "true measurement" of what content you can do in game.

I agree that there's too much weight applied to gear. I'd love to see gear be less important and instead replaced with something like consumables (which would also help drive the crafting market).

There's a world of difference between the balance being off and "an awful player with perfect gear will always do better than a skilled player with awful gear" and I don't agree with that part of your argument.

Skilled players can make up for gear weaknesses they have with skill. That's how you judge player skill => how they respond to bad situations.

I judge my own progress in game play (and knowledge acquisition, and the skill by which I apply that knowledge) by how successful I am at taking on challenging situation with equipment/skills not appropriate for the situation. The harder the mob I beat up, with the least resources consumed and the weakest gear, the "better" I'm playing.

Crissa
05-05-2017, 10:10 AM
There's skill in knowing how to set your bars up to mesh with your gear. It's not like there's super-optimal gear.

The RNG gifted me with knee-kick gear, so I built a knee-kick finishing move set. I've tried to build another move set, but I'll need different gear to drop. At least I know no one will copy my style, because who would have a huge knee-kick bonus?

Then again, it means that the combos are useless to me, since their bonuses only match my gear in performance, but don't match my gear/rotation in abilities. But it does mean if my gear sucks or gets out of matching, I can go back to the combo system instead of leaning on my gear. Which I do when I find things which aren't susceptible to being stunned or kicked.

Yaksnot
05-05-2017, 11:26 PM
Not sure cause I honestly didnt read it all, did anyone tell OP about dmg buff from Calligraphy? that is a 9% bonus thats super easy to get. if OP can afford the skills buy them as that too is a huge dmg boost.

-shrug-

Yak