How strategic should PG's combat be?

[Tinlaar]

I was farming ogres in WN with a few guildmates earlier, and I realized that I could kite them to reduce the amount of broken bones. Our main DPS was pulling most of the aggro and using fire magic, so I figured I could use Apprehend to pull back the ogre and try to stun it, while the group focuses on bursting it down. As long as the main damage dealer isn't getting into melee range and still maintains aggro, this technique could significantly reduce the likelihood of the group getting hit by the bone breaking AoE, because the ogre's rage attack only triggers while in range to hit its target. In light of this, I went on to the PG Wiki and searched for kiting techniques. Surprisingly, this is what I found:


In a game like this, where you can find all kinds of clever ways to stack speed buffs, it’s possible to run extremely fast. This is a problem in a combat, where the players can be much more mobile than the monsters.

One way the game currently addresses this is that you can not “sprint” backwards, just walk backwards. So if you want to get away quickly, you have to turn around.

"But that change by itself doesn’t solve anything, because the game doesn’t force you to face your target to attack things right now. This means you can turn away from the monster, run down the hall at high speed, and keep shooting arrows — the arrows would go through your head and hit the monster behind you. This is silly and bizarre."
— Developer blog May 13, 2014

Kiting is something the devs want to address eventually, although it is intended to allow some amount of kiting — "archers should be able to move and get a few extra attacks in".

This statement is a rather shocking revelation to me, because in other MMORPGs like EverQuest, kiting is a perfectly valid strategy. Come to think of it, it's also rather bizarre that I rarely see other players employing similar techniques. It seems like the focus of the game is to obtain the best set of gear with the mods fit for a few classes, and face-tank everything like a stat-based RPG, rather than placing emphasis on strategical positioning, movement-based tactics like aggro-kiting, fear kiting or using traps. Yes I know that sigil scripting exists, but it does seem like the vast majority of the players I've come across completely ignore it in favor of having more stats or special effects on their gear. Not even world bosses require much consideration for positioning to fight (except for maybe Claudia because of the instakill adds), they're just giant piñatas and everyone just bum-rushes in to land their skill rotation. So I do want to ask if this is the intended playstyle, or is there something else missing here?

[Niph]

Having experienced both games, it seems to me kiting is actually easier in PG. Remember that in EQ, above newbie level, mobs summon when damaged.

The major difference seems to be that every mobs we fight here have some special power that will prevent most forms of kiting: slowing debuffs, range attacks, and so on.

Combat in PG can definitely be made easier with a strategy, but I feel very few people bother or know about it. I know my usual group almost never mezz, because too many things get in the way, and we don't kite for lack of room to do so. But we root and fear very often.

But why bother? For a long time we fought Captain Evergloam in Wintertide starting with a mezz. However, engaging without it recently showed there is no real difference if you have a tanky character.

A lot of people are still improving gear, and this pretty much replaces strategy. Once you have top level gear, you don't need it anymore. There is just no real hard encounter that makes it useful. At least compared to EQ, where once you have top gear then you have a chance at defeating some bosses with strategy. :)

[poulter]

Most experienced players that I know use some form of strategy, but outside of soloing FR elites. it is rarely traditional kiting. As Niph, explained, PG doesn't really make it useful.

e.g. More effective to:
Single mobs - body pull (basically what you did with the ogres) away from the pack
Stun - stop mob damage. Reapply during fight (e.g. Unarmed /Psychology Triple stun build)
Apply group wide AOE healing e.g. Bard, Mentalism, Druid
DPS - Hit the mob - apply de-buffs and rage control on the mob via gear mods
Loot mob
Rinse and repeat

With the ogres in WN, this approach can reduce broken bones from 20+ to under 5, even to 0 per run.

Many vets used to build gear sets around healing, mez, stun and rage reduction, but the current game with its' emphasis on the DPS race, doesn't require it as much.
Plus current Staff /Shield immunity builds reduces risk of failure during fights allowing an organised group to focus on pure DPS builds and to reduce healing, stun, etc, mods in their builds.

[Celerity]

I think it's reasonably strategic, it's much more about what your build allows you to do and the necessity rather than the possibility.

I've started a new fae character and I kite almost every single enemy I fight because I want to be careful and avoid dying. But I use skills which let me slow and knockback the enemy and I actually have ranged abilities to make use of it. A lot of melee skills simply can't do this and even some ranged skills like fire magic have close to 0 utility. Kiting without the mob slowed or you with a speed boost saves you maybe 1 hit, but drains your power and so isn't worthwhile 95% of the time.

On my main in GK and WT I always apply a slow then move back after using my big nuke, in case I steal aggro away from the tank. If there isn't a tank at all then stuff like a slow/root plus a knockback or fear becomes incredibly useful. It's also great vs ogres as you and others have already noted.

The reason you probably don't see it much is because you've probably just been in situations where it hasn't been needed. Ogres are the exception and I'm not sure why some people don't bother doing anything for them, but for basically everything else under lvl 70 it just isn't necessary most of the time.

[Mikhaila]

If you are just running dailies with pick up groups, you'll hardly ever see much strategy. As said by others, just lots of dps works. Strategy starts when either the mission is difficult, or when the group wants to move faster and pull more. I've been in groups that use a ton of strategy and discuss things all the time. These groups move significantly faster through GK and WT, and pull a lot more than most groups can handle.