Beast Form Advice Page

[Nrdr123]

Hello fellow PG players, this is Nrdr123. I am in game usually as a Cow, but I have played all the animal forms, so if you have a question about being a specific animal or would like to know about how being an animal in game is, heck even if you want to chat about animals, I feel like this page is just right. I am always available to help players out, whether in game or on the forum page.

I do specialize in Cow, Lycan, and Pig more so than I do Deer, Bat, and Spider, so If you are uniquely knowledgable about those subjects and there is an individual on this page that may need help in that specific skill set, I ask that you help that player out and commit your knowledge to this forum page.

If you have any questions, or if I can make what I say clearer and more precise, feel free to send a message.

[jackybah]

Hey nrdr123,

I am the guy who was rude enough to put you 'on the spot' in global chat about a week ago. Again sorry about that. I mainly wanted to get away from a discussion at the time about RL politics.
But I would really appreciate a source with some general background information on playing in an animal form.

Some of the questions that came to my mind are:

A. could you give a 'high over' comparison of the differences in game-play-style between the different animal types
( I may be wrong but I think I heard:
Cow is tanky
Pig is very good in bard-like group support
Spider is dps ???
werewolf is dps, with the side note of having very nice increases in dps when fighting in packs of multiple wolves)

B. could you go into some of the advantages of playing ' as an animal'
(of course: what other game will even let you do that !!)

C. could you go into some of the disadvantages of playing 'as an animal'
(beastspeak in chat can mess up your sentences
many NPC vendors will not talk to you
requirement regarding food ? (Cow want to be vegetarians ?)
Storage ?
not being allowed in certain area's
having to find other NPC's (e.g. Animal town)

D. Could you give a small history about how animal forms came to exist
(I recall from a Massive OP podcast, that it was at first 'a fluke' by the DEv's
Citan / Eric originally only intended the Animal forms to be a very temporary curse. Intended only as ' punishment' and to be cured ASAP.
He / they were surprised to find that certain players wanted to continue playing in that animal form. And subsequently the different animal forms
were further developed.

E. Could you give some general tips or advice ?

Many thanks and Kind regards

Jacky

[cr00cy]

A) you are right about cow adn pig. rest of animal forms are mostly dps:
- deer are tankier tahn other, you could call them brusiers, or off-tanks
-spiders are more assasin type, lots of poision and setign up things to gibe high burts
- bats from waht i kwno are more sustained dmg
- wolve sare middle ground - you can build for burst dmg, sort off "assasin", or for sustained dmg.

B) Cows are tanky and have ability to produce milk on they own (but have to stay vegetarina for bette rones)
- deers are faster (have "passive" movement speed bonus, better jump control (which is not soemthign very importnat...) and i think they got soem movement speed bonuses with levels (not 100% sure tough)
- Spiders... well theyc na use illosion to apper as human... or elf, cnat rember(you need moonstone to use it)
- pigs... im not sure.
- bats can fly (i think its best profit form all animals atm)
- wolves can switch between wolf and human form (almost) at will - ecept for full moon.

C)-Some of human/elf npcs in wont talk to animals. Hoever i think every npc in sun vale, Ilmari Rahua and GAzluk will tlak to animals.
-You cant gather wood, or use any items in hand - so no playing music either
-For the same reason you have limited number of combat skills you can pick - only the ones that dotn need weapons will work with animal form (except of unarmed that can be used fully)
Adn i think its pretty much this.

D) no idea, they are all (ecept of bat) was alredy implemented

E)
-When just starting animal say somethign in nearby chat every 5 min or so. That way you will get exp in your Beast speach, and wnt bother people in global
- 3-sylabe word powers inclued ones that will grant you illusion, making you look like elf for 2 min. can be helpfull when talkign to npcs
- You definitly should start working on favor in Animal town asap, especialy if you are full time animal (eg - not wolf)

[Nrdr123]

A.
Cow and Deer are both built as Tanks, Cow as more of your traditional tank archetype, while Deer is in my opinion considered an Off-Tank. With Cow your Tankiness/Tank-like Abilities come inherently from your skills. While with Deer, your tank-like abilities come from having the right mods on your gear.

Spiders would be similar to your dps/assassin types most of their skill is set on using Infinite Legs, or Poison abilities to quickly kill the enemy. The same can be said about Wolves and Bats, their both known for their damage and their ability to keep the pressure on.

Pigs are your support build, they can solo decently, but they are better of in groups, as a healer or a buff build with use of Mudbath, Frenzy, Porcine Alertness.

B.
With Cows your advantages are you are a tank, so you have high survivability. Cows also have a nice sprint skill called Moo of Determination, and they have the ability to produce their own milk, which helps in crafting skills such as Cheesemaking, or Cooking. If you are a vegetarian Cow you have the ability to produce milk every 3 or 4 minutes, while if your a non-vegetarian you can only produce it every 5 minutes. Players can also milk other Player Cows every 15 minutes. Both are considerably better than waiting an hour to milk a specific cow.

Deers have the ability to jump faster/higher, they also have AoE Taunts, while Cow only has single target taunts. They have the ability also to summon another Deer Pet to help out in battle.

Spiders have the ability to use Insidious Illusion to talk to Animal Hating NPCs, it uses up a Moonstone. They also have the ability at lvl 50 to produce their own Spiderweb, which does help with crafting such as Tailoring, especially if they want to make their own Spider Carapace Armor.

Pigs have two sidebar abilities Terror Dash, which gives them a sprint bonus, and Truffle Sniff which allows them to sniff for mushrooms, I believe the higher the Truffle Sniff the higher lvl Mushroom you are likely to get, or the higher the chances you are of getting a mushroom.

Bats have the ability of Echolocation which allows them to see in the dark, such as dungeons (especially helpful with Claudia), and they do have the ability to Fly, they also have the ability to turn players into Bats, so be careful when facing them in PvP.

Wolves have the ability to switch in and out of wolf form(except during Full Moon, when they are stuck for 3 days), they also have specific Wolf-Altar/Wolf benefits, the altar can unlock higher lvl abilities, has the option of being a storage space, and by completing quests for the Altar you can get bonuses like Extra Armor, Power, Health, Damage Mitigation, Bonus Attack %, or a Sprint Speed bonus.

C.
The disadvantages of being an animal are besides Beastspeak, is that certain NPCs will not speak to you while you are an animal. Especially the ones in Serbule. But to counter that there are Animal NPCs in Animal Town which is in Sun Vale, who will speak to you, but only after you have been an Animal for 3 in game hours.

Another disadvantage is your inability to use skills that require hands, such as Sword, Fire/Ice Magic, Shield, and your inability to cut/gather wood, since skills that require the use of Hands do not work, since animals do not have hands (or thumbs).

D.
I do not know alot about how animal forms came to exist, I do know that originally that Maronessa was on Original Tutorial Island and was the boss there. And every single new player just had to ignore the boss warnings and become a cow, so Tutorial Island was usually filled with Cow players. Now of course Maronessa got moves to the Crystal Cave Dungeon in Serbule.

Bats came from a Halloween Event 2 years ago if I recall correctly. Players were turned into Bats, or allowed to turn into Bats, and then they had the ability to transmit their Batness to other players via PvP.

E.
For general advice, I would avoid playing as an animal unless absolutely certain, and after you have explored zones such as Serbule and Etilbule as a human, and gotten at least some storage space, NPC favors done, and gotten used to the general feel of the game. Because starting off as an Animal can be hard or trying for a new player.

I hope I was able to answer your questions, in an understandable manner. If you or anyone else has any questions that I can answer via about Beast Forms or about other skills, feel free to message or post, and I will respond as soon as I can.

[jackybah]

Many Thanks to both of you Croocy and Nrdr !

I will try to work out an Intro to Beast Form 101 page on the Wiki tomorrow.

/Salute to your extensive answers

Kind regards
Jacky

[Elenoe]

I will try to work out an Intro to Beast Form 101 page on the Wiki tomorrow.
Might be worth adding a guide to Human Form as well. I mean, many people play animals in RL pretty well. So a guide how to be a proper human might help some players even more. Just a thought. (Sorry, couldn't resist :) )

Good wiki page btw. I came to find out if I can play as a wolf (not a werewolf) by a choice but already found the answer there. I think I would miss the craft, and the "permanent" scares me a little. Sooo, how is the life of wolf in PG? Meaning is it viable? Or just short time fun but nothing to live with for an eternity as an explorer and crafter (I really like wolves in games. Not many games to play as quadrupeds tho.)

[Nrdr123]

Well I play as all animal forms, I know probably not a good idea to be both a Druid and Lycan, but hey more animals for me. So as a Lycan the "permanent" bit is more 3 days a month during the full moon when you are forced into being in Wolf form for the 3 days of the full moon. When in wolf form you usually have to kill something before you can revert to being a humanoid again, but this is only till like lvl 50/60, by then you can change in an out at will. I don't think Wolves bring anything too much to the table in terms of crafting, but the skill set and mods are great, so Lycans are good in combat, and if you take the Wolfen Speed boosts from the Wolf Altar/from potions you can get a bit of help when running around and doing stuff like surveying or foraging.

Hope this helped, if you have any more questions let me know.

[Hoxard]

As far as crafting is concerned, wolves don't bring anything special to the table. They have the basic animal limitations with gathering wood and the inability to play music for your crops, and their only real advantage is that they can easily bypass them by transforming into a human(Except of course during the full moon, but you'll be too busy with wolf quests to have time for crafting then). They do have a few lycanthrope specific alchemy recipes, but they're rare and not particularly useful.
The real reason you become a werewolf is because it's a fun combat skill. It's got high damage, decent survivability, and quite a few cool spells to play with, and since a lot of your training comes from the Altar of Norala, it's a lot cheaper than the likes of mentalism or fire magic(Sanja's still going to be eating a lot of your money though).

I highly suggest making an alt and trying out lycan for a bit before committing to it on your main. It's a lot of trouble to go through, but it's much less of a hassle than becoming a wolf on your main, finding out you hate the skill and then basically being unable to play for three days every month. You should really only become a wolf if you want it as your main skill. It doesn't have to be your only skill, especially since you can shapeshift in combat, but you'll want to keep it maxed so you can still fight stuff during the full moon.

[Tsugumori]

As far as crafting is concerned, wolves don't bring anything special to the table.

Well despite PG's lack of logic since it lives in the fantasy realm, there is a degree of realism. None of the animal forms can make anything bar Cow & Spider.


...They do have a few lycanthrope specific alchemy recipes, but they're rare and not particularly useful.

The lyco recipes are actually quite useful, on the contrary. Movement speed and damage buffs? They may not be Tesco brand, but "every little helps!"


The real reason you become a werewolf is because it's a fun combat skill. It's got high damage, decent survivability, and quite a few cool spells to play with, and since a lot of your training comes from the Altar of Norala, it's a lot cheaper than the likes of mentalism or fire magic(Sanja's still going to be eating a lot of your money though).

Pretty much yes, its quite a good combat skill. Asides from that... you GET TO BE A WOLF. Another key point would be that combined with survival instincts and mods your AoE can become quite formidable. Not top tier but again - "every little helps!"


I highly suggest making an alt and trying out lycan for a bit before committing to it on your main. It's a lot of trouble to go through, but it's much less of a hassle than becoming a wolf on your main, finding out you hate the skill and then basically being unable to play for three days every month. You should really only become a wolf if you want it as your main skill. It doesn't have to be your only skill, especially since you can shapeshift in combat, but you'll want to keep it maxed so you can still fight stuff during the full moon.

You can make it on an alt, but a case for using a main with lyco is if you want to be forced to work on something else. I have alts for surveying and foraging, rather than using them to stockpile materials from my main I do it for my main. I am a wolf player, I don't advertise it's what everyone should do as it can be a pain in the ass for some people. It is a shame too as the wolf skill is what it is - having more wolf users around is beneficial, better stacked howl buffs and more wolves for parties (packs) to run dungeons together.

This is true though, for the hesitant player, trying it on an alt is best. It honestly isn't that much hassle to get though, few hours at most maybe, perhaps less if you focus on it entirely. That being said, I don't advise ANY animal skill as worth getting if you are completely new to the game. Animals have different NPC interaction mechanics that you should become aware of first before making the switch. (You should also at least know where animal town is...)

And just to comment... while you CAN shift back to human form in combat - you can't change combat skills IN combat. So being human, you'll lose access to your wolf skills and have one skill bar at your disposal. This is absolutely pointless so I don't even know why it'd be suggested.

I think you may have meant.. You don't HAVE to be a wolf. You can shift (OUT of combat) and use skills besides wolf. You don't even have to do that, its not a necessity to use wolf skills, you can use a combination of the other combat skills available to a wolf while staying in wolf form.
(Necromancy, Unarmed, Mentalism, Psychology & Animal Handling - as well as the aforementioned Lycanthropy)

Or you could shift to human form and use whatever you feel like!

[Hoxard]

When you change into wolf form, it automatically sets your top bar to lycanthropy, and when you change back it sets it to whatever you had before.
This means you can have a human only skill on your top bar, and shapeshift to human during a fight to access it. I use druid for the healing. I rarely need it, but it's nice to have it there.
Also worth noting, winter wolf and regular wolf have separate cooldowns, so you can use them both to shift back and forth from wolf quicker than you could with just one.

[Damiv]

Any advice for a new player looking to be a deer? I'm about to leave the newbie island, and have been doing some research on the Wiki (not too much though, gotta avoid those spoilers! :p ). Is it possible to run up to where they sell the deer potions and grab one, before running back to Serbue(?) to start the leveling process? I realize that going into animal form this early in my progression will make some things more difficult, but the ability to play as an animal is one of the most interesting things about this project to me, and I can't wait to start. I've also considered lycanthropy, but didn't want to make a permanent choice so early one. Thanks!

[cr00cy]

Any advice for a new player looking to be a deer? I'm about to leave the newbie island, and have been doing some research on the Wiki (not too much though, gotta avoid those spoilers! :p ). Is it possible to run up to where they sell the deer potions and grab one, before running back to Serbue(?) to start the leveling process? I realize that going into animal form this early in my progression will make some things more difficult, but the ability to play as an animal is one of the most interesting things about this project to me, and I can't wait to start. I've also considered lycanthropy, but didn't want to make a permanent choice so early one. Thanks!

IIRC you cant buy deer juice. You can buy un-deer one. If you wnat to becoem deer you ahve 3 options:
- Get deer juice. It drops form deers (never saw that coming huh?). Or you can buy it from players(sometiem you might find oen in buy used tab on soemwvendors, but i wouldnt count for that)
- Become druid. at lv 2-somethign(25 iirc) you will get ability to turn in and out of deer at will. But be aware that becoming druid is pernament choice.
- There is deer boss in far end of goblin dungeon. It will turn you into deer with its rage attack. But you will need decent party to get you there.

If you are ok with becomign druid then option 2 is your best bet. Gettign ability to switch forms at will is very benefical, especialy for new palyer. You can run to druid altar as soon as you get off the newbie island - you just need to avoid all mobs.

Other 2 options are a bit more hassle - gettign deer juice can be time consuming, or expensive (if you decide to buy it). Findign pary good enough to get to Cervonis can take even longer. You might get lucky and find some high lv player willign to carry you tough.

Actualy, if you wait for the full moon, you shoudl have easy time findign party. Wolves get special quest durnign full moon, and one of them involes killing Cervonis - you shouldnt have much trouble finding someone willng to take you along.



And just to comment... while you CAN shift back to human form in combat - you can't change combat skills IN combat. So being human, you'll lose access to your wolf skills and have one skill bar at your disposal. This is absolutely pointless so I don't even know why it'd be suggested.

I think you may have meant.. You don't HAVE to be a wolf. You can shift (OUT of combat) and use skills besides wolf. You don't even have to do that, its not a necessity to use wolf skills, you can use a combination of the other combat skills available to a wolf while staying in wolf form.



Well, actualy i tried few 3-skill builds (or hybrid builds as i call them). And i must say - it want bad. I didnt played too mcuh with them, but i had some succes.

Most basic one was to have some heling skill on human form upper bar, and use 2 trasformation skills on side bar. This allowed me to quckly switch to human form, heal/buff up, and then go back to wolf form(i was usign mostly psychology).

Other version started when i was experimentign with my necro wolf build. Since i got to 70 i decided its finally tiem to ditch my lv 50 necro neckle. This left me witha problem - i didnt had any armor/jewelery that woudl allow me to use necromancy. I had decent off hand so i started to experimet. It worked well i must say - i woudl summon skeletons/zombie in human form, and fight mostly in wolf, switching occasionaly to buff up/heal minions, and use necrom skills.

Now im plannign on tryign wolf/bc. Since BC attacks have long cds, and wolf(with mods) have quite few long-lastign buffs to overall dmg, it shouldnt be too hard to buff up in wolf from, turn human, throw bombs, then go back wolf and continue fight.

I also tried using wolf as buff abr and then use huma-only skills to fight - liek sword/knife with See red buff, or Hammer/staff with Skulk. While it was interestign and kinda fun (fully moded aoe pound to slag with full wolf buffs... you gotta to try it sometime)

[Damiv]

Hurms, the Wiki states you can buy deer juice, it could always be wrong though. My current plan is to have enough to buy undeer juice at the same time so I can revert back if needed. Then I'll run up and find out. I definitely considered the Druid route, but like Lycan I'm hesitant to make such a permanent change to my character so early on. I just started playing this weekend. :p What are the downsides to druids?

[cr00cy]

From time to time there is druid event. Untill its completed you cant get any exp - combat or crafting. If you participate in event you get tokens you can exchange for consumables and diffrent flying forms

[Tagamogi]

You used to be able to buy deer juice from a vendor in Eltibule Keep. I haven't consciously looked at her inventory in a while, so I don't know if that's still the case? I don't have access to the game right now, or I'd check.

If she still sells deer juice, then getting it from her is very easy for a newbie. If she no longer sells it, you may be able to get some juice just by asking other players. I don't think it is a particularly rare item. You may also be able to find it in another vendor's used or consignment tab.

I wouldn't really recommend becoming a druid just for deer form. You still have to travel to the druid altar and then level the druid skill, and it seems it would be faster to just look for the juice instead.

[Tagamogi]

I finally got around to checking this, and yes, she still sells deer juice. Just be warned that while the deer juice is just 150 councils, the undeer juice is 4500 (you may be able to find a player to sell you the undeer juice a bit cheaper.)

[Damiv]

I finally got around to checking this, and yes, she still sells deer juice. Just be warned that while the deer juice is just 150 councils, the undeer juice is 4500 (you may be able to find a player to sell you the undeer juice a bit cheaper.)

I had noticed that. That's why I need to build up a few councils first. :p Building rep with npcs is such a pain in the ass in this game I've stopped caring that most of them won't talk to me once I'm a deer.

[Eachna]

I had noticed that. That's why I need to build up a few councils first. :p Building rep with npcs is such a pain in the ass in this game I've stopped caring that most of them won't talk to me once I'm a deer.

I'm not sure if you're avoiding killing deer for RP reasons, but the cheapest way to build up a collection of deer/undeer potions is hunting deer. This will also give you combat xp, and harvested materials you can use for crafting, and some equipment drops.

Deer meat is especially useful for a cheap cooking recipe which is good to gift to NPCs who accept meat dishes for favor, or sell for cash. There are a few useful NPCs in game who like raw meat as favor gifts.

[Crissa]

...Well, deer are kinda weirdly rare in Serb. Seriously, no wonder all the tigers are weak or sickly, they outnumber the deer.

[Luka]

Hi, returning player here with a poor memory. I have cow so have done animal forms but much I have forgotton and then wasn't paying attention and got Giant Bat. I want to look at Giant bat before I discard it but I have some questions. What skills can be used with beast forms? And do I need special beast gear to use them. I am asking primarily for bar and cow, atm.

[Tagamogi]

If you are asking about combat skills, the chart at http://wiki.projectgorgon.com/wiki/Skill_Compatibility_Chart is a great resource. It's missing the new bard skill but since that's not compatible with animals, that's ok... The only cow/bat compatible combat skill requiring something special is necromancy which needs a necromancy gem somewhere. I think you can find them on chest items and with the current event, there are also a lot of necromancy-enabling necklaces dropping. Some staffs enable necromancy, but I do not think that works for animals since they can't properly wield the staff.

For non-combat skills, there was some discussion at https://forum.projectgorgon.com/showthread.php?345-Hands-and-skills several months ago - I think Hoxard's summary a few posts down is still correct.

[Coffey1991]

Time to necro some stuff!
I have heard about cow players soloing manticores. What would it take for a deer to do it? What kind of skills, gears and mods would it take to go toe to toe with a manticore?

[Mikhaila]

Time to necro some stuff!
I have heard about cow players soloing manticores. What would it take for a deer to do it? What kind of skills, gears and mods would it take to go toe to toe with a manticore?

Cows charge in where Deer fear to tread. I have heard of some players soloing manticores....very tough to do, very veteran players, and very specific builds. Cow can be very tough. Deer not so much. Maybe if you offered Greenberg a million lemons?!

[Nrdr123]

Hello everyone! I'm glad this thread is still around and active (sort of), anywho I'm around in Global if anyone has any questions regarding animal forms still, and I will also check this forum thread.
Thank You everyone so far that has contributed to the thread, and I hope to see you around in game also!

And to answer the latest question...I would say your gear is the defining factor when trying to solo a very hard creature/elite. If you have the right mods needed to face the opponent, 90% of the time you should be able to kick its ass. But with manticores you must beware being ganked by two or three other Manticores, then that just equals death.
I will need to do a more in depth look at the deer mods and how they work together but I shall give you a more detailed answer later this week.
It also depends on what type of skill you yourself like to use, and what is your preferred playstyle, because that is a factor as well into how well you preform in combat.